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Paddington rulz ok
2 months ago

Official Discussion - Alita: Battle Angel [SPOILERS]


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Several centuries in the future, the abandoned Alita is found in the scrapyard of Iron City by Ido, a compassionate cyber-doctor who takes the unconscious cyborg Alita to his clinic. When Alita awakens she has no memory of who she is, nor does she have any recognition of the world she finds herself in. Ido tries to shield Alita from her mysterious past while her street-smart new friend, Hugo, offers instead to help trigger her memories. A growing affection develops between the two until deadly forces come after Alita and threaten her newfound relationships.


Robert Rodriguez


screenplay by James Cameron, Laeta Kalogridis, Robert Rodriguez

based on the graphic novel series "Gunnm" by Yukito Kishiro


  • Rosa Salazar as Alita

  • Christoph Waltz as Dr. Dyson Ido

  • Jennifer Connelly as Chiren

  • Mahershala Ali as Vector

  • Edward Norton as Nova

  • Ed Skrein as Zapan

  • Jackie Earle Haley as Grewishka

  • Keean Johnson as Hugo

  • Michelle Rodriguez as Gelda

  • Eiza González as Nyssiana

  • Lana Condor as Koyomi

  • Jorge Lendeborg Jr. as Tanji

  • Idara Victor as Nurse Gerhad

  • Marko Zaror as Ajakutty

  • Elle LaMont as Screwhead

  • Leonard Wu as Kinuba

  • Casper Van Dien as Amok

Rotten Tomatoes: 59%

Metacritic: 53/100

After Credits Scene? No

All previous official discussions can be found on /r/discussionarchive

96% Upvoted
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level 1

Just saw the movie and I got one main problem. Did an elite group of the most powerful military units ever created seriously get destroyed by a simple metal ring because none of them thought to jump instead of shooting at it

level 2
1 point · 7 days ago

I think only the URM berserkers were capable of jumping so high, they were not all URM berserkers as I understand it. You can see Gelda (Michelle Rodriguez, the only other one on Alita's level) tells the soldiers to move ahead as they get too close to the top with the defence rings yet to come down. It's kind of harsh, but I think she sacrificed the foot soldiers so they could continue their mission, DESTROY ZALEM! Maybe it would have been better if they only sent people capable of Mario-ing over all the defence rings but I guess they thought they could destroy the ring in time.

level 2

But the ring was successfully destroyed by their fire. What they did not take into account is its trajectory after being destroyed.

level 1

This was entertaining film and Alita herself was great and carried the film. But after time passes there isn’t that much that you are left with out of the the film, there wasn’t much exploration of themes (which seems to have been saved for a sequel) and more interesting characters were sidelined in favor of action, Zapan and Hugo so didn’t get as much time as they neened to be developed. It feels very 90s movie, not cliched exactly but it didn’t offer much new and the cliffhanger ending is what most filmmakers have mostly learned to avoid. Other people have said this would have made better HBO series which I agree with (there would not be as much but action set pieces but if it was a hit the second season might have more). Or just made modern animated tv series. I just would have liked to have have seen more of this world and it and Alita could have carried more slow paced mystery focused series.

level 2
2 points · 6 days ago

For me, the themes of discovering who you are, growing up, love, family, trust and betrayal were more than enough to make this film stick with me on an emotional level. Sure they aren't the most complex themes in the world but they are timeless and watching Alita go through that journey was utterly captivating and it's easily in my top 5 all time films in how it effected me. It was mostly about Alita's development so I didn't feel we needed to see much more from Zapan and Hugo who were mainly there to steer Alita's journey (although I contend that Hugo was not too lacking in his own development). If we're lucky enough to get sequels, as Alita has developed from the naive young girl to the steely determined woman ready for battle in this first movie, we might get more in depth development from other characters.

level 1

Overall I enjoyed the movie very much. The visuals are great, I loved that no doubt. I wanted to see more of the city though. We only got to see them playing the basketball/roller skating sport, in the street then the arena. We didn't see much of the people that live on the ground. Just the doc, his assistant and the street kids.

Why was Alita in the trash though? That part didn't make sense to me. She is supposed to be 300 old, but she isn't even well hidden in the trash, she was found so easily. Also it really didn't seem to me like Alita had much of a personality. It was so generic and typical I mean she basically fell for the kid as soon as she met him.

Still can't wait for the next part.

level 2

I believe there was thrash falling from the sky city at the start of the movie. So I think she just fell down and was up there before, maybe in some ruins or something.

level 1

It just creeped me out a bit how much so many grown men latched onto it, and how it was pitted against captain marvel. Come to think of it it was creepy how she's a kid but then she grows boobs in the second half (and you see her naked - okay sure she's a robot but then why is she wearing clothes later on if she's not naked?). I think it's a movie that was intended for young girls, and that's cool, but the fact that it's getting a cult following amongst anti-SJW men is not a good look. It's very "born sexy yesterday", so that makes sense.

Dramas aside, I think that it is very visually stunning, and I liked that cocky robot (I think his name is Zapan?) but literally every other character is boring as hell, even Alita. Alita is only interesting when she's fighting because the fighting sequences are so well done, but as a person she is a total Mary Sue (a phrase I don't use very often). People are saying the movie has heart but tbh I fail to see anything unique, other than the special effects. The rollerball game was not clear to me at all (are they rollerskating or playing football? both? what are the rules?). I'm not sorry that I saw the film but I am disappointed that they splashed all that money and CGI onto what should've been far better.

level 2

Funny how a lot of feminists disliked the movie, they must be butthurt over something.

Why do Marvel movies get a pass for shit-tier writing in some of their movies that come with 90+ fresh ratings? Come to think of it, fuck critics in general.

level 2
1 point · 6 days ago · edited 6 days ago

I mean you saw what they did with star wars obviously disney is going down the wrong path.

I don't buy movie tickets so they can climb on their soapbox and tell me how I should hire women just because they are women and that we need a fictional country to save black people.

the guy who made disney was racist as shit I really don't need this company throwing millions of dollars on bad films to tell me what's what.

I can't even get hype for a spiderman movie because i'm positive that peter parker's new best friend will be a small muslim kid who gets picked on in their school by kids with trump hats or some shenanigans.

level 2
2 points · 6 days ago · edited 6 days ago

Seems like you have a lot of personal hang ups/bias in judging this movie and who should and shouldn't enjoy it. Alita is an awesome action movie for all ages (10+) and genders with a captivating lead character combining the stunning technical achievement of WETA and the heart of Rosa Salazar in the role. All of the crazy politics on both sides that your view is informed by is just noise.

She's obviously not a Mary Sue either (so if you hate the term, it's weird that you'd choose to use it here...), she basically loses the fight to Grewishka (F Your Mercy is one of the most powerful f-bombs in cinema history) and is only saved by her loved ones, a Mary Sue knows how to handle situations to always overcome them, Alita doesn't have a clue what to do as Hugo is dying in the Church (not to mention not being able to save him later on), she just breaks down watching him die until Chiren comes and helps out. This is not a Mary Sue. I hope most people can see you are coming from a biased partisan perspective.

level 3

You couldn't have said that any better.

And agreed. The use of the F word in this movie was so powerful. I love that scene. Has me grinning every time. It is her defiance at the face of this cruel world and realizing that she has to stay strong, not let herself be changed/bullied.

I might be biased, but I love this movie. Something about seeing Alita grow and try to stay true to herself in this dog eat dog world is amazing.

level 2
2 points · 7 days ago · edited 7 days ago

Your talking points are straight from the feminists articles I've read, so I take it you're one of them. I'll address your points anyway.

It just creeped me out a bit how much so many grown men latched onto it

Aside from the action, the strongest part of the movie was the father-daughter relationship of Ido and Alita. Ido had tragically lost his daughter, and he saw Alita as his surrogate daughter. The care and detail in designing the shell for his daughter that was used on Alita was evident. I'm sorry you can't identify with a father's love for his daughter. Maybe you should stick to Captain Marvel where Carol Danvers' memories of her father was a mean, cold bastard who yelled at her all the time.

creepy how she's a kid but then she grows boobs in the second half

Ido built the first body for his daughter who was much younger. Alita is definitely older. This was revealed in scenes where she's fighting on the moon and ascending the tube to Zalem with her military unit. Stay off your phone and pay attention to the movie next time.

I think it's a movie that was intended for young girls

Let Rosa Salazar explain it to you because you're obviously not going to let me "mansplain" it to you. In short, it's a universal story that everyone can identify with unlike the feminist movie, Captain Marvel.

the fact that it's getting a cult following amongst anti-SJW men is not a good look. It's very "born sexy yesterday", so that makes sense.

Wow, direct talking points by feminists. How Alita: Battle Angel Found an Unlikely Fanbase in MRA Trolls Ironically, it has been feminists and SJWs who have been trolling and bashing the Alita movie. Now they want to claim only misogynist men like Alita and hate Brie "Resting Bitch Face" Larson. LOL.

every other character is boring as hell, even Alita.

Wow, your heart is cold as an ice cube. The best moments are just watching the myriad of emotions on Alita's face and sharing them with her. For a cyborg, she truly is the most human person I have seen in movies in a long time.

People are saying the movie has heart but tbh I fail to see anything unique, other than the special effects.

Some people are just dead inside. This movie is a good litmus test if you still have any emotions left in your body:

level 2

Come to think of it it was creepy how she's a kid but then she grows boobs in the second half

She is not a kid, she was of adult age during the war. This got reflected by the body.

okay sure she's a robot

She's not a robot (I'm getting tired of this actually).

then why is she wearing clothes later

Because, like all people, she is a social creature and walking around without clothes is not socially acceptable?..

It's very "born sexy yesterday", so that makes sense.

The movie subverts literally every facet of the trope, more so, this is the main theme of the movie, but yeah, okay, born sexy yesterday, of course.

You know, the only source of "creepy vibes" I see now is from you. Were you aroused by Alita in her "doll" body? You might need to get counselling on that.

Also I always love backwards thinking. Take a conclusion, and then find a reason that would fit it. Usually - in normal thinking process - observation precedes conclusion. In this case (and it's but one of a bunch) clearly conclusion is the primate and observation is but a tool of support for said primate.

I will ignore the Mary Sue and boring characters part (it is plain ridiculous for me personally, as well as extremely subjective by nature) and will add a small illustration of what I said in previous paragraph: motorball rules, while never stated in full, are quite clearly transmitted by visual means and reinforced by repetition; several teams or individual players race along the track while competing for control over a motorized ball (hence the name of the game); the team (or player) that manages to reach the finish and put the ball into a special socket wins. Again, it was delivered in a fashion so clear, I cannot understand what you were doing while watching to miss it, probably ogling at Alita's ass or something.

level 2

Ok, i just read this, "she grow boobs in the second half". I mean do you realize, what you're saying, basically, she was always this aged, i mean if you didn't know, young girl, grow boobs when they age a bit, and she was always supposed to be "this" old. The only reason why she changed like that is because IDO gave her, the body of his 13 year old girl.

Doesn't matter if anti-SJW liked it, i mean, as much as i know, both side are human, they can both like this movie.

Really, this make me sick, you whole story was designed to be splitted in 3 movies, stop bringing politics in it. It has flow in narrative and such, but if you all could stop being so stupid seeing thing that you want to see just for the sake of political stuff, and give the movie a real chance to develop the story in the sequel that'd be great.

level 2
10 points · 22 days ago · edited 19 days ago

You clearly have some issues. I can't tell whether your protecting or not, but your post history shows that you are absolutely obsessed with your own perceived sexualization of this movie. Is all you think about Alita and Captain Marvel?

I'm nearly 40. My son is 15 and we took a close friend of ours and she is 18. We all thought it was a fun popcorn flick and none of us walked away feeling what you feel about the movie.

Why you sexualized it in your head is your own deal.

level 3

No. Just, no. I'm not obsessed with anything. Just because I have made a similar comment a few times does not make me obsessed. If you think I'm the only one who believes she was over-sexualized then how about you do a quick google and find numerous articles that agree with me.

level 4

Only feminists and SJWs think Alita is sexualized. I just think they hate the fact that Alita loves her adoptive father and has a huge crush on a boy. These are no-no's in the feminist code.

New York Times' Manohla Dargis: ‘Alita: Battle Angel’ Review: Do Female Cyborgs Dream of Breasts?

Alita Has A Design Problem (But It’s Not The Big Eyes)

Why Are Sexist Creeps Pitting ‘Captain Marvel’ Against ‘Alita: Battle Angel’?

Sky Views: A brilliant film - ruined by Hollywood unnecessarily sexualising a character

Alita, the Battle Angel, fights her feminist critics

This one takes the cake, but I have to believe it's some militant feminist website:

‘Alita: Battle Angel’ Isn’t The Feminist Blockbuster You’re Looking For

"Of course, noting that both Cameron and Rodriguez historically like hot, half-naked, armed women, it might not be an intentional appeal to the girl power crowd so much as a manifestation of the filmmakers’ shared fetish for sexy women with guns.

Both men love dirty, fightin’ women so long as they’re thin and hot; in the case of Alita, unearthly thin with unreasonably big eyes. With her inhuman proportions and combat skills, she’s everything both men like in a woman.

Male filmmakers like Rodriguez and Cameron create strong women based on the type of characters they’d like to fuck. That’s not feminist."

This feminist is also a big-eyed bigot: Ultra-Violent Movie, Lacks Heart and Target Audience

I wouldn't even care except that all of these feminists are also movie critics that Rotten Tomatoes uses, so that explains the low 60% RT score for Alita. This movie was for everyone but feminists. I don’t need 40-year-old feminists to tell me what didn’t work about Alita: Battle Angel. It wasn't made for them!

level 4

Oh, I'm sure there is no shortage of people who think she was over-sexualized. People see what they want to see, that's just the way we're wired. Perverts tend to see perverted shit, and there is no shortage of perverts, especially online.

That scene you have such an issue with? I saw it as the nurse telling the Doctor that she wasn't the little girl that he wanted her to be. That his daughter was. She was much more mature. The breasts on the body weren't obscene in any way. Her acrobatics was her showing off how much control she had of her new body. That whole scene was meant to show - in stark contrast - how different from her old self she was. It was the storytellers' way of saying "This is a whole new Alita".

That you and a bunch of other pervs want to make it a sexual thing is just sad.

level 2

Why do you think it's a movie for young girls? Just because it centres around a strong female character? I don't think that is enough to say that that is the intended audience, I don't think that was the intended audience and I don't think manga was intended for young girls either. Also, Alita is not a child, even in her first body she has breasts, the look is that of a teenager, she is played by an actress in her 30s and ultimately she is a 300 year old brain in a robotic body. There are some moments that are a bit creepy if you focus on them, but it's not something that gets in the way of enjoying the movie and considering the Japanese source material they fit right in. Alita is a Mary Sue, but that is kind of hard to avoid without diverging from the source material more than would be desirable, we all love he anyway and the character development makes up for it, I completely disagree with you when you say the characters are boring.

The rollerball game was not clear to me at all (are they rollerskating or playing football? both? what are the rules?).

Seems simple, you play on powered roller-skates and the goal is to put the ball in the thing. You don't really need to know anything more, not for the plot at least, but it seems like a combination of roller-skating, racing and basketball.

I'm not sorry that I saw the film but I am disappointed that they splashed all that money and CGI onto what should've been far better.

It could have been better. It was good. The money and CGI were not wasted.

level 1

it's pretty good, but I feel like despite it's inconsistencies with the source gunnm fans might enjoy a big budget adaptation of this franchise. I enjoyed some light being shed on this overall obscure manga. the average person might enjoy it if they are a a mad max fan or something like that. the time frame cut out a sizable chunk of details though i think if you read the first four volumes of gunnm (mileage may vary, please check with your local game shop or books a million dnd campaign book/comic/manga/funko section geek to verify) you will understand this movie better. overall 9/10 because it was eh at worst and "MOTORBAAAAAALL!!!! NUMBER 99 YEAHHHHHHH" at best. only recommended to the more geeky of you lot.

level 1
-6 points · 28 days ago(1 child)
level 2

I had the same feelings watching this as watching a trash shonen

You take that back, it's among the best smegging shonen there is.

Putting idiotic nonsense like this in the same category as bergman or hitchcock is like comparing phds to pre-schoolers.

Who is even doing that?

level 1

This absolutely blew past my expectations.

The movie looked great and Alita was awesome the whole way through. Hugo was quite weak, but overall I enjoyed this immensely.


level 2

I'm not even familiar with Hugo from the manga, I've only read the first volume so far, but his character is much better developed in the anime. In the movie a lot of depth was removed from his character by making him not kill people and his death is made less tragic by being caused by the villain instead of purely by his desire to go to Zalem and his mental breakdown.


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